[DaddyO]

Well, it's definitely too early to panic. But it sure doesn't look good right now. It's the PATTERN that's disturbing, because it is so familiar from three of the last four seasons. It makes it seem like the team's demise is inevitable, or nearly so. It ISN'T inevitable, but that's up to Wedge and the players, along with just how agressive Jack Zduriencik is going to be with plugging obvious holes and jettisoning dead wood.

It's really, REALLY hard to believe the front office is just going to sit there and let things play out like they have recently. Even if they DO do something, is there any doubt that the things we WISH they would do will not be WHAT they do, things like dump Figgins and reduce Olivo to a backup. One thing they could really do would be to package some of their young talent to get a bat that can solidify the lineup a bit and take pressure off the kids.

It's all well and good that we want the kids to get a chance to develop, but it seems to me you have to also provide an environment where they can learn without too much pressure. Instead, the M's have put them all front and center at one time, oodles of 'em, and said, "Go get 'em guys!" It hasn't worked out so well so far, has it?

[Grumpy]

AlMoStLeGeNdArY, on 23 April 2012 - 02:54 PM, said:

For the streaks to end players are going to have to step up. At our home stand we played the A's Indians and White sox. We went 3-6 at home. Finishing off with get swept by the White sox having a perfect game tossed against us. Now we're going on the road to against Tigers/Blue Jays/Red Sox. I have no reason to believe w'ere going to win any of those games. So far the only series we've won this year have been the two against the A's.

If this team was different we wouldn't of gotten swept by the White sox and we would of swept the Indians. However, it's still the same bums going out there putting up the same results whether it's the old guys or the young guys. There's been some good moments but it's not enough good to totally ignore the bad. We're not the only team to have a losing record but other teams like the Red Sox or Angels actually have the proven talent to turn it around. We on the other hand start bad end worse.

This team is going to need a miracle to win over 60 games in my eyes. I'm not looking at projection numbers I'm just looking at this M's team and realizing exactly how pathetic they are.

The underlying assumption here is that the team will continue to play exactly "as is"... bad luck and all (line drives finding gloves).

The problem with that reasoning is that the team is filled with guys with huge upside... and more on the way. We do play in a tough division, but the pieces are there for a nice season... with further potential beyond that in the future.

Again, completely different from past years.

[Shaggy]

How is Safeco a home field advantage? Considering 2 of our pitchers have never played for the M's until this year (Noiesi and Millwood), there's one pitcher with only 1/2 a year of Safeco experience (Beavan). Montero and Kawasaki new to the team. Saunders and Seagers are playing full time at Safeco for the first time in their careers. Wells & Liddi are getting more playing time being up full time with the club.

That leaves Figgins, Ackely, Smoak, & Ichiro to round out the veterans of the club for fielders and only one of those guys has more than 3 years experience in Safeco. Does Olivio count for ANYTHING? You've only have two veteran starters that have extended periods playing in Safeco with Felix and Vargas. I didn't include any of the relief pitchers.

This post has been edited by Shaggy: 23 April 2012 - 04:06 PM

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

Grumpy, on 23 April 2012 - 03:25 PM, said:

The underlying assumption here is that the team will continue to play exactly "as is"... bad luck and all (line drives finding gloves).

The problem with that reasoning is that the team is filled with guys with huge upside... and more on the way. We do play in a tough division, but the pieces are there for a nice season... with further potential beyond that in the future.

Again, completely different from past years.

It's not really that different we're still waiting for Smoak to live up to his potential. We're still squandering great pitching performances from Felix. We're barely putting any runs on the board.

We're going to need Montero & Smoak to both have MVP type of season. To go along with a Cy young type of season from Felix. Vargas can't go back to being who he is. We're going to need more from the rest of the rotation and from the BP. We need Ackley to do more we need to actually bench players who shouldn't be considered everyday players (figgins & Olivo). Guti & Carp need to come back and hit the ground running we can't afford them to struggle. Ichiro needs to be better.

We don't need that for a month or two weeks we're going to need that sustained for the rest of the season. I just don't see it happening. That's too much to ask for from this squad.

This post has been edited by AlMoStLeGeNdArY: 23 April 2012 - 03:46 PM

[Grumpy]

AlMoStLeGeNdArY, on 23 April 2012 - 03:45 PM, said:

It's not really that different we're still waiting for Smoak to live up to his potential. We're still squandering great pitching performances from Felix. We're barely putting any runs on the board.

We're going to need Montero & Smoak to both have MVP type of season. To go along with a Cy young type of season from Felix. Vargas can't go back to being who he is. We're going to need more from the rest of the rotation and from the BP. We need Ackley to do more we need to actually bench players who shouldn't be considered everyday players (figgins & Olivo). Guti & Carp need to come back and hit the ground running we can't afford them to struggle. Ichiro needs to be better.

We don't need that for a month or two weeks we're going to need that sustained for the rest of the season. I just don't see it happening. That's too much to ask for from this squad.

Well, if you expect the exact same level of play with no improvement from any players, and the exact same situation with line drives finding gloves, and no reinforcements in the pen, then there's nothing I can say to that, because you'd be right. The team will continue play well below .500 pace.

But I think that those assumptions are unlikely. BTW, we don't need or expect MVP seasons from Smoak and Montero. Average/solid (or at least growth/acclimation) seasons will do nicely.

[senior octobre]

Jokestar, on 22 April 2012 - 12:09 PM, said:

Well, I had high hopes for the team this year. Oh well. With the possibility of another 100+ loss season looming ahead of us, we can add the humiliation of having a perfect game thrown at us. Kinda like a rotten cherry on top of the steaming pile. Go M's.

Did you see the strike zone for the CHI SOX pitcher ? It was obvious in the seventh and eighth that the M's would have to hit their way on base because blue wasn't going to walk anyone and the M's looked as they took their ab's that they understood this as well. One game.

[Shaggy]

After 18 games last year, the Ms were 6-12. The Ms were swept by the Rangers, Royals and Indians. Last year we didn't finish our second series with Oakland until the 22nd game of the season. We split them with a 4-3 record during that time.

We are playing nearly .500 ball against some pretty tough teams. Oakland is better than they were last season. As pointed out earlier, had a few hits or a change in pitching taken place when needed the Ms would be above .500. This is not a team the same team as we've witnessed in the past. It's too early to panic. Each game, there are signs that when they put it all together, it's going to be a fun ride.

I believe in the King and Jesus!

[phredmojo]

Shaggy, on 25 April 2012 - 12:52 PM, said:

After 18 games last year, the Ms were 6-12. The Ms were swept by the Rangers, Royals and Indians. Last year we didn't finish our second series with Oakland until the 22nd game of the season. We split them with a 4-3 record during that time.

We are playing nearly .500 ball against some pretty tough teams. Oakland is better than they were last season. As pointed out earlier, had a few hits or a change in pitching taken place when needed the Ms would be above .500. This is not a team the same team as we've witnessed in the past. It's too early to panic. Each game, there are signs that when they put it all together, it's going to be a fun ride.

I believe in the King and Jesus!

no one is panicking, some of us just know that this is not a good team and come september will be proven right and some of you believe it is..

[Baseballfan]

Ok, I can't resist. What in the world is a "good team"?

Are the 2012 M's a 95 win team.... No
Are they a 90 win team... Probably not
Are they a .500 team... Maybe
Are they a 70 win team... Yes

Other than position of finish in the standings, what makes a team "good"?

[Shaggy]

phredmojo, on 25 April 2012 - 01:36 PM, said:

no one is panicking, some of us just know that this is not a good team and come september will be proven right and some of you believe it is..

Many are suggesting this team isn't any better than the previous two years. I beg to differ with that point of view. I've never said this is a "good team". I do know that the Ms have youth with tremendous upside. That said, there is a lot of potential to crash and burn with this team too. You take Olivio, Ryan and Chone out of the lineup and this team can win. Who you replace them with is Z's challenge and something I'm sure he is well aware of. But to suggest this is the same team is clearly focusing on the negative and not seeing any positives with this season.

[senior octobre]

IMHO, the M's have to be able to beat LAA, TEX and OAK. Until they can do this, they will be a .500 club. I'm looking forward to when TEX arrives at the Safe.

[AlMoStLeGeNdArY]

senior octobre, on 27 April 2012 - 09:40 AM, said:

IMHO, the M's have to be able to beat LAA, TEX and OAK. Until they can do this, they will be a .500 club. I'm looking forward to when TEX arrives at the Safe.

We've proven we can beat the A's. As for the Rangers and LAA that remains to be seen. I don't think we can beat the Rangers but it may depend on who's pitching. With the way the M's have played at home this year I don't really want to see anyone at home not even the royals.

[Vidya]

Our next homestand is against the Twins and Tigers. If we can't come out of those games with a winning record, then we should simply play all our games on the road. Too bad the new roof doesn't have tiles.