[TGoddard]

Check it out.

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All winter I read negative stories about the Mariners from Mariners fans. The team was lucky last year, so you need to knock them down a peg before you start with a 2008 projection. The offense gets bad marks. Why are they going to trade Adam Jones? The list goes on.

However, in the spring of 2007 I picked Seattle as my surprise team, and they stayed in contention a good long while. I really don't see why they shouldn't again.

Sounds about right to me.

[Vidya]

LAnaheim Angels? Sounds cool to me. This guy makes a lot of sense to me.

I can't bookmark him, because I'm out of town for a couple of weeks, and not at my home computer.

[Lakay]

Vidya, on Mar 25 2008, 02:07 AM, said:

LAnaheim Angels? Sounds cool to me. This guy makes a lot of sense to me.

I can't bookmark him, because I'm out of town for a couple of weeks, and not at my home computer.

You can del.icio.us

[Chaos_Effect]

I have a technical problem accessing baseballmusings.com and I'm wondering if anyone can help me. When I try to access it on my laptop at home it always says that the page cannot load, but when I access it at the library I can get on just fine. I'm using firefox at both places, so it's not a difference in web browser . . .

[TopCat]

From the article...

Quote

Ichiro is every bit as good as Vlad Guerrero, although their skill set is different.

At DH, Vidro is at least as good if not better than Garrett Anderson

[lisa mariner]

Also from the article ...

Quote

I just don't see the reasons for pessimism with this team.

Glad I'm not the only one

[MR. BASEBALL]

why do you not believe this expert, Mr. Cat?

We all know how you feel about Ichiro but it is hard to deny that Mr. Vidro is the equal of Mr. Anderson. Yes, Mr. Baseball knows that Mr. Anderson had almost 3 times as many HR's as Vidro despite playing 40 less games. But, let's look at RBI's! Okay, Mr. Anderson trounced him there too but how about doubles and triples. runs scored, yea, that's it!

nevermind

[lisa mariner]

I guess even some Halo fans aren't too thrilled with Vlad ...

Angels Win discussion about Vlad not happy about platooning in RF ....

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He's one of the worst regular outfielders in the game. He was a sloppy fielder in his prime, who tended to make up for it with a cannon arm, but now with some physical limitations, he's way, way below average. Needs to DH regularly and only play OF to rotate GA (which may be a common occurance).

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Vlad has committed either the most or 2nd most errors in RF during 6 of the last 7 years. Eventually Vlad is going to have to realize he's a liability in RF and will have to accept a fulltime DH role, whether he likes it or not. This will have to be made very clear to Vlad if the Angels decide to extend him. At his age and with that size, those legs and knees will only get weaker, which will make his range and mobility that much worse.

[Gomez]

Wait, when did old, crappy cars become journalists?

[TopCat]

MR. BASEBALL, on Mar 24 2008, 12:43 PM, said:

why do you not believe this expert, Mr. Cat?

We all know how you feel about Ichiro but it is hard to deny that Mr. Vidro is the equal of Mr. Anderson. Yes, Mr. Baseball knows that Mr. Anderson had almost 3 times as many HR's as Vidro despite playing 40 less games. But, let's look at RBI's! Okay, Mr. Anderson trounced him there too but how about doubles and triples. runs scored, yea, that's it!

nevermind

LOLOLOL

[TopCat]

SABR Matt, on Mar 24 2008, 01:21 PM, said:

When you narrowly focus your definition of a DH on RBIs and extra base hits, that's what happens...you miss a LOT.

Maybe it should give you pause that a long time well-respected expert thinks Vidro is a quality hitter.

So you wouldn't trade Vidro for GA?

[MtGrizzly]

Anderson, 2007:
.297 .336 .492 (OPS+ 114)

Vidro, 2007:
.314 .381 .394 (OPS+ 109)



Seems like there is something there to support both sides.


Edit to add: You're going to have to get a restraining order on MrB before this year is out Matt. He's got your number, man. Knows just what buttons to push to get you going.

This post has been edited by MtGrizzly: 24 March 2008 - 02:48 PM

[eric k]

I think what this really says is that Garrett Anderson isn't that great of a choice for DH either

[Pirata Morado]

SABR Matt, on Mar 24 2008, 06:08 PM, said:

I'm not saying Vidro is "that great"...I just am tired of reading illogical histrionics from Ms fans claiming Vidro is the worst DH EVAR!!!

The problem with Vidro isn't him per se, but rather that he is using the DH spot were one would expect a higher power production, that's all.

[MR. BASEBALL]

lisa mariner, on Mar 24 2008, 12:56 PM, said:

I guess even some Halo fans aren't too thrilled with Vlad ...

Angels Win discussion about Vlad not happy about platooning in RF ....

Man, Mr. Baseball is going to admit he had no idea the fans of the Monkeys were concerned about Vlad's defense. what would they do if they had Mr. Ibanez?

[MR. BASEBALL]

SABR Matt, on Mar 24 2008, 02:38 PM, said:

Only reason I would is because GA can play the outfield a little still.

But as hitters...they're not as different as people here claim.

Well, Mr. Matt, as you have said before, Mr. Baseball is an old crab.

Guilty as charged. That said, he still believes the object of offense is to touch home plate or be the dude that allows a homie to touch it (rbi). Mr. Anderson drove in 80 runs in 104 games. He scored almost as many runs as Vidro also. Plus he doesn't clog up the bases quite as bad and can actually play respectable defense.

Respected baseball expert? Perhaps in your opinion. He doesn't seem to let facts get in the way of his drivel.

[BatGrrl66]

Come on guys relax! My feeling is that the Seattle fanbase and the Blogosphere people have expectations that are inhumanly high concerning the DH spot (remember Edgar?). Going by the stats they are fairly even.

[TopCat]

MtGrizzly, on Mar 24 2008, 02:46 PM, said:

Anderson, 2007:
.297 .336 .492 (OPS+ 114)

Vidro, 2007:
.314 .381 .394 (OPS+ 109)



Seems like there is something there to support both sides.

Like what? The only number that has any meaning above that favors Vidro is OBP. That's it.

This post has been edited by TopCat: 24 March 2008 - 06:20 PM

[BatGrrl66]

TopCat, on Mar 24 2008, 08:19 PM, said:

Like what? The only number that has any meaning above that favors Vidro is OBP. That's it.

You know more than a stat line goes into it, things like place in the batting order is huge (given the baseline expectations per spot are widely different). Either way I look at those numbers and I see little difference beyond power numbers. And those can be so overvalued as to be useless in certain comparisions. Vidro is far better than the blogosphere intimates but that doesn't mean he is God's gift to the position.

This post has been edited by BatGrrl66: 24 March 2008 - 06:34 PM

[TopCat]

SABR Matt, on Mar 24 2008, 06:39 PM, said:

Of course I would never argue Vidro is God's gift to the position.

I argue that Vidro is solid...a little below average but the smoking crater in the offense than everyone in Seattle thinks. I'd rather have Edgar any day. I'd probably rather have Clement. But Vidro will do a good enough job to help us compete.

And "the only stat that favors Virdo is OBP...that's it!"...that's half the battle in producing runs, TopCat (not exactly half...but a huge chunk)...getting on base. That's a completely weird statement to me...OBP is a BIG DEAL...Seattle fans should know this considering how much we all want the Ms to take more walks and get on base.

Well now, thanks for the stat lesson Matt. You keep preaching the joys of Vidro. Nevermind he's our resident sloth. And despite GA having way fewer ABS, he scored almost as many runs. And Vidro plays ZERO defense. The guy is a one dimensional player.

At the end of the day, he is what he is. Yes we could do worse.

I'm still laughing however at the very idea that Vidro is better than GA. And you're wrong about GA. He can still play OF rather well. He's no longer a CF to be sure. He still has a great arm as well.

Nevermind the VLAD laugher. That one is even better.

This post has been edited by TopCat: 24 March 2008 - 07:30 PM